Submachine 5: The Root

I don't believe the answer is 42. I believe that the answer would be up in the thousands. I will have to consult my statistics book to work it out

Ok, I've finished the game, but apparently the machine with the four screens and four clickable buttons (see the screenshot at the top of the page) does nothing? Weird.

I loved it! Thanks to everyone for their help. That was a nice surprise when I came into work this morning.

I adore the submachine series! Please Mr Skutnik could you build in a "Save progress" element as I have to go to work now and I'll have to start all over again when I come home!

Guys,

there are more and more copmments in JIG that contain more ore less blatant spoilers to the game without bothering to hide them under a spoiler button.

Please, don't do this. Please, use the spoiler tags.

Thank you.

bio

I'm having a weird problem...

Never mind, I finally got it, though I'm still not sure what area I clicked on that did it.

Anyway, great installment as usual, but after all that we learned in 4 I was hoping for a little more plot advancement at least. Do we have to wait until 6 to find more answers?

Well, that's another morning off spent in front of the PC instead of going outside or getting stuff done. In this case, that's a good thing. Very nice.
Finished it and only missed one of the secrets without a walkthrough, although it was pure luck when I found the bulb.
3 questions though:
1) Is the spiky door trap thing just a red herring or can you get through?
2) Does the observation room actually do anything? I'm confused as to why you make a note of it.
3) What does the little grey box with the wires inside (Stage 1, number 17 on the walkthrough) do? Why do you open it?
Just wondering...

Excellent game, I really enjoyed playing this one. And to repeat Bio's request, lets not ruin the game for other people and use the spoiler tags to hide things that would take away from a first time player's experience of the game.

Just thought I'd join in the mathematical debate going on...

Or:

The part where

is just unfair. Sad to see Submachine take a trip to the realm of Pixel Hunting - especially with basically underlit screens (which would be no problem)...

Oh look, it's The Pearl.

If I see sentient smoke, I'm outta here ;)

Wow,that was rather disappointing. I expected an epic flash adventure and we just got what is a pixel hunting pile of crap compared to the others.

Whoever made this walkthrough gets mixed up with their left and right....

DANGIT!!!!!!!!!

i accidentally clicked on the 'main menu' button in the 'secret location' before i could use any of my 5 secrets!!!

can someone please please PLEASE post in a spoiler or email me what we find out in there?? I finished the whole game with all 5 secrets and i clicked the wrong button :'(

I wouldn't go so far as to say it turned into a pixel hunt especially as you can see where you need to click, yes it didn't elaborate at a few points what needed clicking eg; for the power plugs clips if it had had a small animation of them impeding the plugs removal it would have been fairer. I think the game tends towards showing the mysterious side of the network while at the same time interlinking prior locations into the overall storyline. Also the secrets were well hidden and I found the utilisation and reward for them to be one of the best yet.

Actually, there would be 49 rooms, as the blank also counts in the beginning and at the end.

All of the combinations:

49 rooms!

I love this stuff. I downloaded it & played some of it full screen. Well, not FULL screen but, you know. I still got a ways to go. The music and sounds are so immersive, even more so than the earlier games.

If you're like me you might like a concise list of secrets after you finish the game, to achieve full closure:

There are a couple things that seem like they MIGHT be worth something, but as far as I can tell never amount to anything.

Great game overall. I don't agree with the comment about a pixel hunt, but there were a few things I wish were worked on. Example: the light bulb

can I get a hint as to what I'm supposed to do with the secrets once I'm done?

I haven't even played yet...I'm just going to do a little happy dance first!

You know what I just noticed? All this transporting through weird machines, code combinations, and obscure symbols reminds me a lot of one of my favorite TV shows, Stargate SG-1 :P

There's 43 combinations of 6 cipher plates, E. Brown. All of the doubles except 0,0 don't count (you can't put cipher plate 1 into both slots at the same time).

@castawayboat

where are all these other cipher plates you speak of?? I only have the two needed to complete the game.

@ E. Brown:
There would only be 43 rooms. We don't have duplicates of the plates.

As for what to do with the secrets, after you win you get the option to go to the secret room, where to the right of each note there is a slot to place a secret.

Also, I got stuck on the location of the light bulb and used the walk through from there, where does the clue for 747 come from?

you guys figuring out the math need to remember that (0,0) is the only double.

this means that there can only be 43 combinations.

Whee. Not bad, though I do agree that The plug (as well as the secret hidden in a bit of furniture--being purposely vague here so as not to be too badly spoiler) were pixel-hunts.

As for the people doing combinatorics--the answer is 43. (not 49, since the *only* key that can be doubled is '0').
A simple explanation that doesn't require stats/combinatorics to understand:

You have 7 'keys' counting 'blank'. This gives you 7 possibilities for one slot. Ignore the fact that blank can be doubled for the moment--this means you have 6 possibilities for the other slot, for a total of 42 possibilities. (0,0) is a special case, since 0 is the only one that doubles--this makes a total of 43 possibilities.

Then again, as someone else pointed out, (0,0) might not be counted as as a 'possibility'.

Of course, this all assumes that each of those hooks was for a *different* key, and not, say, pairs of each of keys 1, 2, and and unseen 3....

I just jumped out of my chair and did a full-on happy dance, chanting "NEW SUBMACHINE NEW SUBMACHINE NEW SUBMACHINE!"

I'm SO happy! I just replayed the entire series less than a week ago. This is, far and away, hands down my favorite casual game series in existence.

Post-game warning/bug!

If you leave your cipher plates in place within a transporter--and not in your inventory--and then click the link to go to the Secrets location, you will lose your cipher plates. I only have four of five secrets, and I've lost my Cipher 2 when I teleported directly from 2,0 to the Secrets area!

Alternately: If I'm just being dense about this, and there's a way to get it back, do please let me know? I've searched all of the areas to which I have access with only my Cipher 1, and I don't think my Cipher 2 respawned anywhere. This game has replay value, but not INSTANT replay value--I didn't plan to play through the whole game again just to see the fifth secret.

Scottique--I guess we will happy dance together!

OK, having finished the game with only 4 of the secrets, I assume I wasn't allowed to go to the special secret room?

@Jay: I went back through the walkthrough looking for secrets and still only found 4--one of the directions had me turning left in a room in which there was no left turn. I believe it is the clue for secret #2.

@dsrtrosy

Poohy - inventory glitch? I was just in that room that you need a lightbulb, and trying to get the charged coil to be used as a lightbulb (I can't be the only one who tried that...), then I put the coil back into my inventory - on top of the lead casting. It got stuck there. I was clicking randomly, trying to get it out. When it was all over, the lead casting was frozen/stuck - unclickable - in the inventory, although I got the cipher plate and charged coil out - yes, I somehow got the cipher plate stuck too.
Can't drag the lead casting, nothing pops up when my mouse is over it - it's like it doesn't exist anymore! The lead casting is stuck and I can't click it anymore );
Darn! And then i closed the game and gave up. What on earth happened??

Yay, i rule. Mateusz Skutnik said so!

Uhhh... Guys? About the 6 ciphers math debate...

Not that hard, guys...

Great game this one! Unfortunately I couldn't find the bulb by myself... Had to get a spoiler. But that's a very awesome game!! Congratz! Continue to do your job Murtaugh! = ] Cyah later!

Eric, you forget to include the possibility of not using a cipher key, i.e. the 0.

I beat the game and the music won't turn off!!!!

Yeah, the total number of rooms exist if there are 6 cipher plates is 43(including 0,0), the formula for this is n(n+2)+1, where n is the number of cipher plates

I disagree with the above.

Wow... I've really got to stop caring about maths...

Gotta love the SubMachine :)

This one was good. The only thing I didn't like was the size of the game play window. The notes were a handy idea but a couple of times I couldn't read my notes cause the writing was too small.

Can't wait for part 6!

Here is a complete spoiler :)

The Lab
pick up notes from the ground.
go left and open the hatch.
go down the ladder and to the left. Turn on the computer. Read onscreen notes (crucial information will be written in notes).
go far right and open door.
enter new area and go right.
open another hatch.
go down the ladder and right.
enter numbers 5-5-2 on the portal. and hit the button.
The ROOT
go right until the opening in the wall.
enter the opening and go right. In the screen where colors change notice an object. Lead Casting. Pick it up.
enter the ROOT location.
open the box on the wall.
notice small locks right next to the big plug. Click them and then click the plug. Click the plug again to power up this location.
go right and down and right again until you find a ladder going up.
go up the ladder, then go far eft and enter the control room.
pick up wrench from the ground.
exit the room and go back to the lower level.
locate ladder going down and go there.
go right and use wrench to unscrew the plate from the wall.
collect rusty key.
go back to the level eith control room, but enter the previous room. The one that you previously passed by going to the control room.
use rusty key on the left panel. Collect cipher plate 1.
go to the level below and locate a device on the wall. It’s a transporter, you can use the cipher plate 1 here in two ways. put it to the left slot (which will be later on described as (1, 0) or to the right slot (0, 1).
put the cipher plate 1 to the right slot (0, 1) and hit the button
(0,1)
you’re on the ladder. go down. And enter the chamber on the left. Collect cipher plate 2. From now on you can use both cipher plates and their different combinations on that transporter. For your convenience I will describe combinations using numbers, so for example combination (1, 2) means that you have to put plate 1 to the left slot and plate 2 to the right slot.
go back to transporter and enter (2, 0) (explanation: right slot i empty, left slot is occupied by cipher plate 2)
(2,0)
there are 3 hatches here, you have to set the devices inside them so that everyone is facing right. (the middle one is already on the good position. In this hatch you collect empty coil.
go back to the transporter and enter location (0, 1)
(0,1)
go to the bottom and right. use the empty coil on the charger and turn the wheel three times. collect coil.
go back to the transporter and enter location (1, 0)
(1,0)
go down and right and place coil on the pedestal.
go back to the transporter and enter location (0, 2)
(0,2)
go down and far left. on the way you’ll notice signs on the wall, they will be written down in the notes.
on the far left turn the valve;
go back to the transporter and enter location (2, 0)
(2,0)
go far left and enter new location through the whole in the wall,
collect wisdom gem 2 there
go back to the transporter and enter location (1, 2)
(1,2)
now it gets tricky. there are 8 rooms surrounding the central one. go to that room and look through three holes in the walls.
the pointer must meet the ornament on the rim, and you turn the pointers using the valves on the outside. Once you place pointers in the right positions, the block in the middle of the central room will open. collect metal box.
as you leave this room, go through the right door and collect light bulb – it’s the only one not protected by the wires.
go back to the transporter and enter location (2, 1);
(2,1)
go right and up. set both devices so their lights are on the right side, the crate downstairs will move it’s position.
go right and down the ladder. In the dark room use the light bulb on the lamp next to the ladder.
go left and into the ancient room.
on the wall use previously seen symbols (they’re written down in the notes) and hit the button on the bottom. go down the ladder and use lead casting on the highest pedestal of the anubis statue.
after it’s lifted, collect lead casting from it and repeat that two times until the passage is opened.
go down and collect wisdom gem 3.
go back to the transporter and enter location (1, 0)
(1,0)
go down and right to the acid bath. Zoom in.
put the metal box into the acid.
once the metal box is destroyed zoom out and use wrench to unscrew the pipe and release the acid.
zoom on the bathtub and collect wisdom gem 2
go back to the transporter and enter location (0, 0) (remove the plate from the transporter so it stays empty, and hit the button.
exit the ROOT location and go back to the modern portal.
enter 7-4-7 there and push the button.
The Corridor Location
go far right and open the door.
enter the new room and use all wisdom gems on the wall machine.
switch the lever on the control panel and enjoy the ride.

Awww! it was too short. I demand more submachine!!!!

@Edd
oops, stupid typo....

Whoooaaa man! Now we have complete walkthroughs posted in the discussion without a spoiler hide????

I second the previous comments about not getting AT ALL specific in our comments without using the spoiler tag, and would STRONGLY urge anyone unfamiliar with the use of the spoiler to do a TEST first! I'd really like a chance to read the comments and play the game without unwanted "tells".

Thanks in advance to everyone and viva Skutnik!

SWEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!! I am over the proverbial moon that there is another Submachine game out. Will there be any more? I was gonna watch sailor moon which I've just bought but I think I can put it off for a bit to play this. :-)

LISTEN. CAREFULLY.

If Cypher Plate 1 is in the first slot, then there are 7 possibilities. (1,0) (1,1) (1,2) (1,3) (1,4) (1,5) (1,6). Now, how many possibilities are there for the first slot? 7. 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6.

Ladies and gentlemen...... 49 POSSIBILITIES. 7 times 7! Stop makng it more complex than it has to be! 2 slots! 7 possibilities in each slot. 7x7=49. @_@ Guuhh...

Anyway... yeah. 49.

SORRY. WAIT. NO. I haven't had a lot of sleep, and I must not be thinking straight. x-x I failed to account for the lack of duplicate cypher plates. 43 is correct, and that formula is correct.

@-@ Please pardon my newbishness. I knew not of what I spoke.

I think the appropriate equation would be

(n^2) - (n-1)

where n = 7, because you have to allow for zero as an option. and the (n-1) allows for no duplicates except the 0,0.

just my two cents.

Gloriously simple and fascinating game. i enjoy every second... and then come back for more!!

;->

I agree with the 43 stated above.
Since all of you asked for it: that's the mathematical demostration that uses a bit of combinatorics.
Excluding room 0-0, the problem is the following:
How many ways there are to dispose 7 possible objects (6 possible plates + 1 "slot left empty") in groups of 2 (order matters) without repetitions?
That problem is a "Permutations without repetitions" one (see: here) and the solution is 7!/(7-2)!=7!/5!=7*6=42. Since we have excluded room 0-0, the total possible locations you can reach with 6 plates is 43.
In the more general case of "n" cipher plates we would have: (n+1)!/[(n+1)-2]!=(n+1)*n=n^2+n combinations (0-0 excluded). So, including 0-0, the total rooms we can access with "n" plates is:
n^2+n+1

Just a little atmospherical note on the above comment. That demonstration is under the hypothesis that the 3 cabinets should contain 6 plates that are all different between each other.
It is possible that the 2 remaining cabinets could simply contain duplicates of "cipher plates 1" and "2".
It could be very plausible that they can put duplicates in room 0-0 as a security measure, since this is the only room that is accessible without any plate.
Another thing to consider is that "cipher plate 1" has only one stub at the end of it and "cipher plate 2" has 2. It seems here isn't any space to have 3 or more stubs at the end of a cipher, so if the series goes on like this, there isn't any additional plate.
If that's the case the only rooms we haven't visited yet are only "room 1-1" and "room 2-2" and we can't say if the cipher holder admits the use of 2 identical keys at the same time (it can be forbidden for one person to have 2 copies of the same cipher).
Since Murtaugh's comment isn't totally clear about this argument, we can't say for sure if there really are other locations accessible with that method.

what are the symbols? been thru that room several times and cant find them.

I didn't know this was out!Waita minute??ITS OUT!?!?!?OMFG

Woah...through the brick wall is a few rooms of -
Submachine 2 : The Lighthouse!
Murtagh made the bricks crash in so we couldn't just go to the lighthouse portal and randomly get teleported

Umm i finished the game so i can answer any questions...

...but I still don't know what the 23 tally marks have to do with anything (you find them very near the beginning).

I dun see the connection between Submachine 4 and Submachine 5....

Sub 4 said that we can start working from the lab from tomorrow..(???)
Sub 5 , we appeared in a different lab instead of the one in sub 4...I DUN GET IT!!!

I posted about 3 times ...Just to tell u

I have finished this, but am wondering what the machine in the control room was for, where

Becca, when the comments section tells you to write spoilers like "<spoiler>example</spoiler>," it doesn't mean that you should put the word "example" in between the tags, it means you should put the ACTUAL SPOILER in between the tags.

this game reminds me of the cube series of movies

I really do love the automatic note feature in Submachine V. I really hope Murtaugh adds that feature for all future Submachine games. It is quite convenient and prevents waste of sticky notes or paper in the real world.

help im stuck on the part with the symbols

I am so happy I know whats behind the brick wall in #2

CIPHER PLATE 1!!!!!!!!!! WHAT DO I DO WITH IT!!! i read the walk through but i dont understand! im in the room with the grey box with a button and wires coming out of it!! :-(

I like having that magical notepad thingy around. It saves a lot of trouble typing it all out yourself. I think that this was a very well done game and I can't wait for the next one.

Although the dark atmosphere does creep me out a bit...

who cares how many cipher combos there. who would honeslty want to explore 49 rooms or how ever many there really are for a light bulb.(P.S. submachine will never end :P

As an epic fan of all the previous subachines, the remixes, the spinoffs and so on, I regret to say that I found this game disappointing. As I've felt about certain other games, I've loved every minute but the minutes run out too quickly. The atmosphere, sound and art were as incredible as ever, but for one thing it (at least seemed) shorter than the Lab, possibly just because of the much more limited exploration possibilities; once you have the two tag keys there are no more areas to discover, no more secrets to find, and the portal machine was hardly used.

Every submachine game since the Lighthouse has extended the submachine mystery, unveiling a little more of its secret, or told us more about the mysterious 'Mur'. This game I felt told us nothing that we didn't already know and completely failed to develop any of the mysteries we found in the Lab; where are the other exploring teams from the lab for instance? And more importantly, what is the submachine, how did we end up in the submachine and what is its relationship to 'the real world' are all mysteries I wanted to see developed here.
Also I felt the concept that we're now working for Mur and the lab removed a fair portion of the atmosphere. We're no longer persuing an answer to the mysteries of the game; we're just doing a job like anyone else. It's as if Neil Armstrong, upon arriving on the moon, had just sat inside the rocket and watched TV until it was time to go again.

Still we are yet to meet Mur or any other living creature; still we know little of the purpose or nature of the submachine. We want to know so much about what it is, how it came about... We've seen a buried lighthouse but have no idea why it was buried, or by who. We know people are investigating the submachine, but where are they? What's with the ruins? The ship? And how are we (the player) inside the submachine? Where did we come from?

It was a good game, but not up to the normal submachine standard, and I felt it failed to develop the plot suitably.

FOR THE AUTHER

hey lets go authors submachine 6 come my way this one was harder and funner so keep it but dont make it to hard so I have to check a walkthrough just make it a bit harder and you will have one (or 5 if my friends get a chance to play) more visitor/s thanks again for creating a 5th and the secret room was cool if you can add a few more secrets thank you

i can't find the fourth secret.

please help.

Hello, its 43 combinations, I am a maths freak and have no possible care for arguments.

By the way here is a simple complete walkthrough
with secrets for those who find things hard.

Watch this people, all the combos

0,0 0,1 0,2 0,3 0,4 0,5 0,6
1,0 1,2 1,3 1,4 1,5 1,6
2,0 2,1 2,3 2,4 2,5 2,6
3,0 3,1 3,2 3,4 3,5 3,6
4,0 4,1 4,2 4,3 4,5 4,6
5,0 5,1 5,2 5,3 5,4 5,6
6,0 6,1 6,2 6,3 6,4 6,5

hmm i got 37 now hmmmmm.....

...I'm a bad gamer and didn't search the site before submitting this game just now. Was offline the whole week when it came out. *blush*

roydaman

You have 7 rows of 6 (plus one on the top row)... 7x6=42...+1 = 43.

I really can't believe people are still arguing that number.

I too, would like to know why there are some seemingly unusable "red herrings"...
Such As:

It cracks me up to no end that someone made "example" their spoiler... I suppose computer logic doesn't come naturally to everyone, right?

I gotta go to bed.

*love to all the people who make these games available to us for FREE!*

~tig

There was a room I couldn't get into, at the place with the egyptian theme, there is a doorway with spikes, any ideas on how to get passed it?

Has anyone actually found any more cipher keys than 1 & 2?

I'm also confused about the seeming red herrings

but also the other one

So pleased that a new submachine is out. Roll on the next. At least I can get some sleep now I've finished.

@ Roydaman

Just signed up for this place O_o

Tigrress should be right. The formula is x!/(x-y)+1 where x=7 and y=2.

I still don't know how you get 3,0 over... I only got 2 Cipher Plates 1 and 2

Jay, how does the TypeKey work?

What are the 3 symbols in room (2,1)? For some reason, there is no signs on the wall in (0,2) so I haven't been able to acquire notes needed.

@ Rankai
If you found 5 secrets and went to the secret location,

i got the cipher plate 1 and i cant find the teleporter to the 0,1 rooms. where is it?

wow.. how can someone possibly finish that game without the walkthrough??

i love the gameplay, i love the look of it, but sincerely, the first were more enjoyable for me, because i could actually finish them practically alone.. but this one is too complicated!! :P

very good work though.. even if it doesn't suit my little brain.. ;)

That spike door is from submachine 0.That observatory room has 4 screens anf 4 pictures where in the secret room.That brick wall comes from SUB 2 So many earth there.If i didn't exit that lighthouse with that giant light bulb I was DEAD now.

ugh i clicked the main menu button before using all five of my secrets!

*sigh*

i was fast enough to click the spike door. and in got a sixth secret! wooooooooooolo!!!!!!

i found that the number of rooms for the cipher things was 50. dont ask how i got that number, cuz i have no idea myself.

FFFFFFF U U N N !!
F U U N N N !!
F U U N N N !!
FFF U U N N N !!
F U U N N N !!
F U U N N N !!
F U U N N N
F UUUU N N !!

There are 43 rooms in the game IF the 6 cipher plates were available.

Don't believe me?
00, the root
01, 02, 03, 04, 05, 06
10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16
20, 21, 23, 24, 25, 26
30, 31, 32, 34, 35, 36
40, 41, 42, 43, 45, 46
50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 56
60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65

Oh, yeah, and Talps, this one shows us the root of the entire story, the first ever submachine, and showing the Submachine as an ancient net. So it tells us something that happened before Submachine 0, which, storywise, happened before Submachine 1.

I LOVE Submachine. It is TOTTALY my favorite game. I stumbled on Submachine 2 at Arcade Town I think. Off the chart 15 million stars+. Can't wait for Submachine 6. Oh I know what you wnat to say. "Oh how to come to know that Mr. Smarty-Pants. Well try collecting all the secrets in Submachine 5. Remember: ALL THE SECRETS! By the way, if anyone knows the moth and day of the next one please tell me. Thanks.
P.S. Plases do NOT tell me the year, I already know. HA.
P.S.S. Do I talk to much?

For those who didn't get 5/5 secrets-

I can't believe you people. Raising mathematical debates about pointless things like how many rooms you could visit with how many cipher plates. You never have access to more than two plates, so what's the point of speculating about more?

...Incidentally, for six plates the number is 42, not counting the origin (0,0). Thirty possibilities (6x5) for two plates, plus six for the left slot only, plus six for the right slot only.

Hi there! I just found out about this game and I want to know this: Can I save my progress?
Yesterday I was playing and had to turn the PC off. Somuch for my progress...
There's this Escape the room game called VISION where there's a save button and that's genius.
So, what do I do?

How do you turn the pointers in 1,2?? I am having seroius trouble with turn the bloddy things.

ARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! And here I was searching for this game... and then I find it months after it's out?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

and hey, Andy? What do you mean "fast enough"????

by the way...

Oh, and I really like this series except for the spookiness. The dark lighting fried my nerves months ago...

wheeeee!

I saw this a while ago, thought, "I don't have time for this at the moment," favorited, then finally got back to it now, played it, with the help of the walkthrough, because even though i love these types of games, the only way i can beat them is if they're putt putt, freddy fish, or spy fox, anyways played it, beat it, went to secrets room, inserted 1 secret, went left, saw buttons, went clicky, and back to start screen... noooooooooooo!!!

i wish it auto-saved or something...

but about your guys' argument about the thingy with all possible combinations of ciphers, etc., think about it... it makes 49. take out doubles, we get 43. take out (0,0) because as someone said, the maker, (mateusz?) doesn't consider it secret or something, and we get 42. what else do we know about 42?

thus it is the answer. thank you. if you don't know what i meant, go read RIGHT NOW!!

sorry about possible double post, forgot two things:

1. Can somebody post what all of the secrets are? not where, what. like at the end of the game thing. cause of previously noted mistake.

2. I sympathize with _star*~_. these games are spooky. the one that he made with the deserted town, traumatized me. stupid little hairy man........