When the pure light that sustains the alchemists starts to dwindle it's what's referred to in the industry as "A Major Problem", and it's up to you to restore civilization in this gorgeous and brief metroidvania platformer.
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That is the most beautiful game I have played in a month of Sundays. Kevin MacLeod's sound track alone would earn it a 5/5 by itself let alone anything else.
If you are like me and hate hitting the help then rest assured that this one just takes you to an overview map. Very helpful!
I personally thought the check points were fairly spaced given that you did not lose any items if you died before reaching one.
The only thing that gave me any trouble was
catching a mouse, but I knew it had to be somewhere having tried to leap off of every available precipice!
I just need the last igredient 9the rune) but I can´t get it from top of the edge. Anyone?
Okay, how to catch the mouse?!? I feel like I've explored the entire map.
@ana
Have faith, remember what the runes said about walking from the top edge at the east
@username
Look lower than you have looked before
you can drop down where you went up to the chest on the lift
Wonderful, thank you!
I liked the review better than the game. The game seemed too simple; too much like a copy of all the other games just like it.
Mmnghh..I really wish people would stop calling games like this "metroidvania". This is an exploratory platformer at best. Metroidvania, to me at least, is about going around and exploring, killing enemies, and collecting upgrades, most of which either give more ways or make it easier to kill enemies, and some of which make the enemies more survivable. In short, I don't think any game where you can't even attack qualifies as a metroidvania.
Well, yep, decided to play the game because I saw "metroidvania", except that I'm dissapointed that it isn't at all.
8771. Not that bad a game. 4.5 stars. What the heck does "metroidvania" mean anyways??
@satori: Clearly, you've never seen FMA.
This is not a metroidvania game. At all. Even if it were, 'metroidvania platformer' would be redundant since both metroid, castlevania, and metroidvania games are platformers.
@Xindaris, uncopy2002 and ProfPuppet,
I hear you guys, and you do have a point. I went with 'metroidvania' for this one because it's a standard JayIsGames tag for games with the qualities Xindaris described. I thought Alchemist had enough of the qualities of a metroidvania title to interest fans of the genre, and I tagged it as such to make it easier for them to find. I concede that Alchemist isn't a strong representation of the genre for the very reasons Xindaris mentioned, and so I used "metroidvania platformer" because I'd gauged it as being somewhere between the two game types. In future, phrasing it like metroidvania-esque or simply as having some elements of the genre would be more accurate. Thanks for your feedback!
Yet Another, Not-Metroidvania Comment. Please remove the tag.
Also, as ProfPuppet said, Metroidvania games are by definition platformers.
On an unrelated note, I miss the days where logins were not required to comment.
Tried three browsers. I almost rage-quit from lag. But a very pretty, albeit short, game. Thank god the map was small enough to not require hours of searching back and forth.
Phew. I was actually worried I was quibbling about terms and nobody would agree with me. Heh.
Such heat over such a beautiful game. I am however going to add some fuel to the fire.
Satori is corect in one very important respect to quote - I thought Alchemist had enough of the qualities of a metroidvania title to interest fans of the genre
When I see that tag my face goes all upsy daisy yes! By the time I realised it was not quite, I did not give the proverbial fig - I was hooked into a game that has all the beauty and atmosphere (and a few quests) I would expect from such a tag. I very soon realised upgrades were not going to come .. but it was too late by then I was hooked. It seemed so mean in my original comment to say it was not metroidvania.
Short, simple, sweet, beautiful I can only hope for a sequel.
((on a side not I still cannot see how or why the guys here at JIG refuse to review Boundaries of truth, in my mind one of the best undiscovered metroidvania flash games, imho))
I thought metrovania was a platformer genre with the twist of upgrades that allow the player explore more. Games like Pieces, Knytt Stories and Robot Wants are platformers with collectible upgrades.
Hi yaddab,
I'm not sure where you get the idea that we "refuse" to review a game. I don't see anything in our submission box related to that game whatsoever. If you think a game is worth a feature, by all means submit it like everyone else! :) With the literal hundreds of thousands of games out there, there will ALWAYS be games we simply miss... that's what makes our helpful community so welcome when they let us know.
To everyone else,
I'm thrilled to see such a spirited, passionate, intelligent conversation! All I want to do is remind all of you to keep it clean, and keep it civil. :)
Hi again guys,
I've conceded that Alchemist isn't a strong representation of the genre, and explained a little about my reasoning as well as how we use tags here. At the risk of disappointing, that's about as much as I feel I can reasonably do here. As much as I'm about fan service, changing tags solely due to reader comments would set a dangerous precedent in terms of trolling. And due to reader comments would be all it would be, since I felt and still feel that it has enough elements of a metroidvania title - my own take on the genre being more exploratorily-based than combat-based, as AstractMatter's is - that despite it not being intensely metroidvania, I still feel that it is metroidvania. In deference to the feeling of many of our readers, I've already agreed to apply it more selectively in future because we're a games site, and bringing people disappointing experiences is the very opposite of what we set out to do every day for you guys. I hope that will be enough for you.
The only other thing I wanted to present for your consideration is the idea that while many - perhaps even most - metroidvania titles have been platformers, there's nothing written anywhere mandating that they always have to be. New games are coming out all the time, and if crafting games can be seen as the latest generation of metroidvania elements - also hugely debatable - then titles like Minecraft can be seen as proof-of-concept that metroidvania doesn't always have to presuppose platforming as well. In the seething cauldron of ideas and elements that is the internet game development community, definitions aren't always hard-and-fast, and often personal estimations play a big part.
P.S. @cevgar : The logins were an unfortunately necessary response to spambots logging in and ruining it for everyone. It wasn't our first choice either, believe me.
Log-ins have been required for commenting for a very long time. Years in fact. :) They were briefly disabled a month or so ago, and turned back on for the reasons Satori describes.
Not to beat a deadhorse, but to me Metroidvania is pretty clear cut. Examine the core elements shared between Super Metroid and Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, arguably the games from which the term was originally derived. AKA: a single large explorable 2d platforming map, broken into subsections with various obstacles scattered about requiring the player to find/unlock skills, equipment, items or defeating bosses before going back to reexplore. Puzzles, Non linearity, backtracking, secret areas, maybe some hidden skills or mechanics the player can figure out on their own (Soul Steal, Crystal Flash). That is Metroidvania.
Well, you say, aside from the platforming bit, that sounds an awful lot like Zelda. And that is the key isn't it? The community went out of their way to create a term to describe a Zelda like platforming game. Zelda is excluded from the list. So, if I may repeat myself, by definition, metroidvania games are platformers.
As for '3d Metroidvania'... as far as I know, there isn't really such a term. Mainly due to the fact that 3d metroidvania has far more in common with Zelda than Metroid. I'm pretty sure those are still being classified as Action-Adventure... or something. "The Secret of" series was labeled Action-RPG, so maybe Action-Adventure-RPG? These days games are getting so free form that they overshoot the mark and go straight to sandbox. If anyone knows the proper term for Zelda-like games, please let me know!
As for Minecraft, that is obviously sandbox. It is almost the definition of sandbox. Any other classification would be silly.
(FYI: While an excellent game, I don't consider Cave Story worthy of the Metroidvania tag either, due to linearity. Having multiple smaller maps instead of one large map is a big part of the problem. There just isn't enough focus on exploration. If memory serves me right, Alphaland and Recluse also fall short.)
@Dora: Yes, I know. I was a reader years before the login requirement went up. Though I think I've only commented about four times since. Hate required logins.
Sorry Dora, refuse was a bit strong, and not what I intended to mean - judgement of any game will always to subjective! The perils of internet communication.
Anyway posted in support not to muddy the waters here any further
This is going to be less about the game and more about the tag, so let me get it out of the way: I liked Alchemy, it's a good game.
Not a metroidvania at all, however.
So, allow me to summarize what I see here in the comments so far.
Satori thinks that metroidvanias aren't necessarily platformers.
(inferred from Alchemy having the metroidvania tag:) Satori thinks that metroidvanias don't necessarily have upgrades
Satori thinks there are enough metroidvania elements in Alchemy to interest fans of the genre (can we get a list of those elements, at least?).
Satori thinks that Minecraft is a enough of a metroidvania to bring it up in this discussion.
Satori thinks it is a good idea to use tags on a major site according to his own personal estimations of what tags mean and not what the readers expect them to mean (and go out of their way to vocally state).
Satori thinks that changing tags due to reader comments would set a dangerous precedent in terms of trolling.
I was originally going to comment, but when brought together like this, those points pretty much speak for themselves. Then again, maybe they only do only for those who already know and care what a metroidvania is. For those who don't know, let me present this quote:
While Joystiq is hardly the ultimate authority, this is pretty much the most to-the-point definition I could find in 5 minutes. Most importantly, it tells you what you get when you remove elements Satori considers non-essential (unlike just about anyone else commenting on the issue).
So, why is this tag thing so important? Because now I know that tags on JIG don't mean a whole lot. They can be used like in SEO optimization at best ("hey, this is sorta relevant, so we gotta add it!") and arbitrarily at worst. Ending? A roguelike. Kairo? An FPS. Pacman? A metroidvania. Hey, it has enough of the qualities of a metroidvania title to interest fans of the genre! (the only element of metroidvania that Alchemy has is that it's a platformer, and, apparently, even that is not essential, so why not Pacman?)
So yeah, congratulations, JIG's tag system can no longer be trusted to represent much of anything.
But still, I want to offer some words of encouragement to Satori. Stay strong, and don't fix your mistakes. This would set a dangerous precedent in terms of trolling.
I have to apologize. Misspelled the game's name every time I used it (that's a whopping 4 of them). I'd love to correct my mistake, but it seems there is no way to.
I think people have been rather rude...
Nice game. Though the lagging sort of bugs me.
Once again, I would like to remind people to please keep things civil. Flames and snark don't build bridges and open minds. We welcome all constructive, healthy, polite feedback, and politely request that players deliver it in the manner they themselves desire we respond to it. We respect you guys, and I humbly request that you do the same to us, even when we don't agree.
danwerald, first off thank you for taking the time to comment, and so intensively at that. What you've seen from the discussion so far is completely Satori-centric, and I'm flattered! (I think.) =)
I don't know where you work, but I think we can both agree it would be a bit odd for clients to come into the office not only demanding changes in the office filing system, but with the expectation of entitlement on their part to do so — and a ready willingness to berate an employee who declined to do so and demand to know precisely why they didn't accommodate the client. That would be... a novel approach to things, at best.
If an office were to set a precedant like that, clients would come in demanding all sorts of changes to the filing system. Because these changes would be now at the behest of the clients rather than the office, anything could end up filed as anything else due to angry demands now that standardization has been lost. You've cited that as a concern of your own, so this is a concern that we share. Now disagreements in tagging are going to happen, between readers and writers, readers and other readers, and probably once in a while writers and other writers. But someone ultimately has to make the call on what a game is tagged with. At the moment, it's the writer and other staff. Are we going to start tagging games whimsically to play hide-and-seek with the good games, or out of a delusion that by SEO-ing everything at the readers' expense we'd somehow be getting ahead as a site? No. Is everyone always going to agree on every tag? No. Can we all still get along and enjoy some fun free games together? I'd like to think so.
I'm not saying this to be mean to you danwerald, and with all respect to you as a reader, the tone of your comment is a pretty good illustration of the kinds of responses I'm concerned we'd start getting if we began letting readers redetermine our tags. Increasing upset and berating tones in the Comments, often from readers of various camps who'd campaign for or against this or that, leading to flamewars, isn't the kind of thing we want whether it's deliberate trolling or simply conversations getting heated. Making it a possibility for readers to redetermine our tags as the result of vigorous campaigning and angry comments would invariably encourage an unending procession of precisely those things. And this is time we could be using to bring you some of the best new games around... only we're not. We're locked into an angry discussion with a few users in the Comments. Self-evidently, there's a point of diminishing returns there for everyone involved. =)
When a conversation gets heated or its tone gets demeaning, I'm placed in the position of walking a delicate tightrope between ignoring reader concerns on the one hand, and fanning a burgeoning flamewar on the other. It's about at this point that you'll find I typically disengage in an effort to keep things civil on both sides, and so that I neither feed a flamewar nor encourage anyone else to either. It's on that general principal that I'm not continuing to debate the specifics of my decision with you, but I did think you and other readers deserved to have the information and a response. Please try not to let a difference in interpretation about one tag ruin your day. =)
This is beautiful, but almost unplayably slow.
And it's absolutely not a metroidvania. :)
Thanks to all for your participation in the debate.
It's good to discuss about different opinions, feelings.
I fully agree, this game can't be tagged 'Metroidvania' so the mentions have been removed.
One more time, Satori wanted to express 'people who like Metroidvania should like Alchemist'.
For me a true Metroidvania like is Darktopia
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