hiram - I have yet to make it through, unfortunately. As busy as I am, it will likely be yet several more days before I am be able to finish.
And yes, I believe I have the correct sequence for one of eye puzzles.
Level 1 (4 eyes on each wall, one on ceiling):
Wall 1 is designated as the wall immediately to the right of the main corner switch, and numbering around the room clockwise, with Wall 4 being the wall immediately to the left of the switch:
Wall 3 - top left
Wall 3 - top right
Wall 4 - top left
Wall 1 - bottom left
Wall 4 - bottom left
Wall 1 - bottom right
Wall 2 - bottom left
Wall 4 - top right
Wall 3 - bottom left
Hi and thanx!
Curious isn't it? I did just that, clicked every face of the activated room, the walls were all coloured, but nothing happened! I had a hunch that was the thing to do, but nothing happened! (realized after trying again that I hadn't done it at the same occasion in the room...) Having tried it once I discarded that solution erroneously.
Getting stuck on extra difficult Sudokus too!
Here's my interpretation for the end game. Read on your own responsibility:
When ever you manage to get some of the circles filled in the middle of the cube then just go to the each sides of the cube and look through to peepholes to find out where that beam comes.
So what you need to seek is orbit and planet that follows exactly on it's displayed orbit.
Then the lens that is light up correctly is in the opposite side of the cube.
You may also want to find out in which rooms you need to light only the "main colors" (red, blue, green).
After that try to find where mixed colors are needed.
Finally when you know what colors are needed and where, then the remaining task is to find out how you transfer the colors to the correct rooms where they are needed.
And the colors of the rooms do not have anything to do with the colors needed in them!
umm all i see after i press the start button is a blue button, i clik it and all is black what do i do
hi, this is my first time posting. i read the above comments about the first yellow room, the one with the two arrows and the planet images behind them, but i am still having some major confusion
i got all the arrows so that each color was pointing to a specific side, but it's not accepting my answer. any help?
i'm having trouble on the first amoeba room. it's blue and there are three amoebas with three different color options. any help?
The first amoeba room is just like the second amoeba room:
Every amoeba that casts the same shadow needs to be the same color. However this is easier because you have three arbitrary colors to work with. Clicking on an amoeba will move it two steps through the color cycle and the other amoebas one step.
Ryan, something about the general outlay of each room:
In a top corner of every room there is a button the same color as the room, but shinier. Press it to access that room's puzzle; press it again to put the puzzle away. Once te room has been completed the button graphics change slightly, and you can press it to get a map of the exits. You'll need to close the map before you change rooms, though.
The code for the green room, 3rd level center:
Single eye on panels puzzle
If the starting panel is #1, and the panels are numbered 2-4 going to the left(!)/counter(!)clockwise:
1, 2, 3, 3, 1, ceiling
Since I was even emailed on this, I will give some extreme help for really desperate people struggling with the "yellow room with background maps and different color arrows on it":
And are you sure that you have tried to understand my earlier tips?
Are you absolutely sure? Okay, in that case, here you have it:
Amor Lassie, I solved the puzzle using your picture, but the answer seems to defy logic to me.
If a person is thinking about the faces of the cube as the mixed-up faces of a sphere, then the arrows are not, in fact, pointing in the same direction. In your image, one of the red arrows is pointing south, and the other is pointing east. In another orientation the red arrows may both be pointing north, but the green arrows would then be pointing south and west. How in the world did you solve that puzzle? It seems to me there must be a different explanation.
Ah, after reading G.F.'s post, I understand it.
Drinkdrawers, I'm happy that you understood. I just did not wan't to make it too simple like saying:
Forget the compass directions. Think the planet like a box where two people, one at the north pole, and other one at Kolumbia try to point out the shortist way to Kongo. (And now even that became said ;-)
A couple of final end game tips that may be useful
When the final planet is lit up properly...
Nothing seems to have happened.
But an exit has been opened up somewhere
The white room, the farthest from the room you started in
Can anyone advise on the spinners:
When e.g. a ray is going from bottom to top through a spinner and a dead-end stem to the right and clicking the spinner makes it rotate 1 quarter turn clockwise (see the room directly above the blue power switch, the first spinner the blue ray passes through):
When I click, why does it open up and shoot out rays in all 4 directions (instead of just shooting from bottom to right with the line that shifted to the left becoming a dead-end stem)?
Go upstairs or to the right hand room and find out ;-)
It is better if you try to solve all the rooms first and then find out what these spinners do.
The spinner isn't necessarily shooting rays out in all directions -
The light path may be snaking through adjacent rooms and coming back to go through the spinner another way. There are only a few places for the light paths to end, so the light can go for a while after you open a spinner.
I'm still not getting through the fish/tadpole room (2nd red room). I've read the solution, and that what I was expecting the solution to be, but it doesn't seem to work for me.
They won't stay on the panel when I click them, they keep moving around
When you click them, they sort of dance in place, but they stay where they are.
If you're on the 3rd fish/tadpole room (with 3 different kinds of tadpoles swimming around
then you need one of each kind of tadpole on each of the 6 panels.
Thanks Hiram, but I was doing something else wrong
It needed to be a single click, not a double click or other kinds of multiple clicks :-)
After I figured out what I did wrong, it was easy. Now merrily going around the other rooms and a little stuck on the white one, but not in need of help at the moment
Hello, this is another lurker coming out from the depths. I'd like to say that, after a week or so, I finally finished this wonderful puzzle. Well, I may not have called it wonderful while playing it, but that's arbitrary. Thanks for all the hints and tips on here, they helped out an awful lot.
finally done. I do not understand the globe room (someone from this thread basically gave me the answer). Can anyone explain it? My confusion is spelled out inside the spoiler tag:
I drew out the squares and cut them up, then re-assembled them into something that looked more-or-less like a globe seen from six views. This followed pretty well from the colorful blocks room (it was the same puzzle). But then I could not figure out what to do with the arrows. So I looked on here and bothered a knowledgeable player via email. He revealed the mechanics of the solution: the arrows, in colored pairs, point towards a third side of the (reconstructed) cube which is adjacent to both of the others. So if I take my model and forget all about it describing a globe, and think of the arrows as rotating around on faces of a cube, the arrows (in color pairs) have to point the same direction. NOT towards the same point -- in fact, they are describing parallel lines in the 3D space of the cube. Okay, easy enough to point all the arrows based on that rule, and the puzzle is solved.
But I just don't get it. Every other room in the game contains its own discrete logic, and its solution stems directly from observable puzzle components. This one seems to have an arbitrary solution. What am I missing here?
Do the pairs point towards sides according to the two colors of arrow present on that cube face? If so, by what logic? And did I just randomly choose the correct one of the 2 possible alignments for each color pair on the first try?
I took a picture of my map & notes/models when I got done.
Hey Frontalot - nice picture!
Do you mind if I use it in the hints on my site?
Regarding the globe puzzle:
The idea is that there are 12 coloured "arrows" orbiting 3 axes of a sphere; similar-coloured arrows must be moved to positions where their orbits _intersect_.
The main problem is to piece together the sphere given the information of the shapes of the "continents" from 6 different views, as you suggest.
Thanks for playing,
I finally beat it thanks to all of you especially tiralmo. Oh, and on my victory message I totally wrote more than "Yay!" I really wrote "Yay! #14 but i finally beat it thanks to all those at jayisgames.com" and something else too but w/e i beat it (exhausted sigh) time to get some sleep. OH and one thing that will save you trouble on the final puzzle, dont make asumptions on which lens goes where even when u only need to know where two are. So i kinda beat the last puzzle twice, once with two wrong lenses and once with the right ones.
Hi Jay, I'm having trouble with the red level with red wedges with a dot on the backside. You posted quite early on that you solved it. I have all the sides but two. But now I can see there is no (apparent) way to get all the dots pointing out because several pieces remaining are all aligned in the same direction.
What am I missing, besides half my brain? (It rotted because of that peaceful sound of diatonic crickets chirping and whales singing for the past four days.)
Mc Frontalot, i don't know if it is logical or not, but here's the process how I end up to the solution in yellow room with background maps:
First I ignored the maps. I just tried everything out. What if I point the same color arrows to the same direction according to the room? What if they point to different directions? What if they has to point to the nearest other rooms with similar color?
Well since nothing of these didn't work out, so I started to study more closely also the backgrounds. Probably because I have studied land surveying and mapping I realized that hey, theres map of some planet from six different directions. Then I just immediately tried my first solution: to point the similar color arrows to same direction but not according to the room or looking the box inside out, but lookin the box from outside. This was logical to me, but i don't know whether it is because my educational background or what.
What is afterwards a bit odd is that I didn't even thought the solution that someone else tried, to point the arrows according to compass directions. Maybe because in back of my mind I realized that there's no compass directions on the poles.
Kendrick - congratulations, and thank you kindly for the advertising in your victory message. =)
Christine - the beautiful thing about that puzzle is all of the pieces can be fit anywhere. You can switch the orientation of any piece simply by sliding it from the bottom corner of any side, down to the floor, and then up to the bottom corner of the adjacent side from where it started. Likewise, the same thing can be done top corners and the ceiling.
So, you may need to disrupt an already completed side in order to switch around a piece that needs reorienting.
Does that help?
I have to admit that Dark Complex is absolutely the best Internet game that I have played so far. Thanks to Jonathan for letting us to play it for free. And thank you Jay for the best Internet game site ever. I have not visited in any other Internet game sites after I found this one :-)
> You can switch the orientation of any piece
Ah, I think I vaguely noticed that, but hadn't been paying attention. Definitely helps, thank you Jay!
Cheers, Amor Lassie! =)
And I agree, Jonathan's games are of the best available on the Web.
Hi all! A hard days work, but still no success on the map room (the yellow room with two arrows on each wall, or rg. for one of the notations I've seen) I have read all the spoilers, and I have made maps and tried to put them together, but nothing has really helped. Glazius Falconar, I have despite Your predict actually managed to get through all of it except this room.
Does anyone have a scheme for the arrows, it might help better than the spoilers I have read so far, and definitely better than brute force, which would lead to 8^24 possible combinations.
Best wishes. Doc.
Doc, here's half of the scheme. You have to figure out the logic and the other half:
Thanx Amor, but so far I got by myself. I seem to have gotten it all right except for the yellow and cyan arrows that was pointing directly opposite, due to the fact that I couldn't locate the thin fragment of island anywhere. I have got the map completely made out for me now.
Very often a scream for help can be the catalyst that brings thoughts in order!
I am working on a walkthrough, if someone is interrested.
Arggh! Starfield makes no sense! Imagining a 3D field didn't work, since the stars don't match up with adjacent sides. I'm losing my mind here.
Sfogg, don't loose it!
The starfield is invisible! It is in the room. What You see are mirrorings of it, hence they don't make sense when You turn the room around... Play calm and color one at a time. At the bottom of the field You see three stars in an L kind of shape. Start with the middle one and paint it on all the walls. Remember that the mirrored L is farthest on the ceiling. First You have started to paint one through the field it grows easy to orientate.
Almost through now! Doc.
I found a short path in the bottom middle violet room. I followed a long spoiler before, but I wanted to explore it all by myself, and found this
Consider the wall right of main button as W1, next turning right W2 and so on.
Press in order
and the roof and you're done!
hello guys! i must admit.. the game is awesome... much better than the Dark room which i loved :) but also this game drives me crazy... im completely stuck and lost... can't figure out your "map" guys to find my place and a good way so im walking around over and over... could you please help me? and please give me a hint on a puzzle with 3 "bubbles" on each wall... what im supposed to do?
Sunny - I have yet to figure out the map myself, mostly because I haven't had much free time to devote to this rather large game. I am looking forward to finishing it soon, though.
About the 2 "bubbles" on each wall. I believe you are talking about what has been referred to as the "amoeba" rooms, and there are two that I know of. You will find hints about them in the comments above, just search for "amoeba" on this page. =)
Sunny, have you noticed this map:
On this map the gray box is the room where the whole game starts. In the middle is the room that you can see only through the peepholes.
It seems I have lit up all lenses with the correct colours, assuming red lensroom should shine red and so on, but I only get the magenta planet to shine. Does every room have to be passed by some ray? Do the rays have to end up where they started? Gonna try it tomorrow, but I felt like asking. This is my last quandary, and I'm done!
My walkthrough will be finished when I'm done. Gonna post the URL then.
Good night! Doc.
Finally I finished all the rooms (except for the white one, but I'll get there someday). One thing I couldn't get it is if we are inside these cubes or not? It seems to me that we are outside the cubes, looking at them. And we can spin them around to see each of their faces. It doesn't make sense because we should want to escape. Am I seeing it in a wrong way?
Anyway.. This game is absolutely fantastic!! You got to love it.
Doc, the color of the lensrooms
does not have anything to do
with the colors of the beams.
Very practical advice:
is to lit up only e.g. green light and then try to find out in which lenseroom it is needed. When you see that green planet is lit up, then you just have to find out from which room the correct green beam is coming. Since there might be more than one lense lit up, then the correct lens can be found by
going around the cube and checking through the peepholes till you see the green planet following precisely the same color orbit. Then you know that the right room is in the opposite side of the cube.
After that you can repeat previous procedure with blue, then with red, and then with mixed colors. Finally you just have to find out how to ensure that each color is directed only throw these lenses where needed and no through any other lenserooms.
Satirus, I agree on this "reversible perspective" problem.
Especially in The Dark Room i saw it all the time as a cube looking from the outside. But the idea is that you are inside of the network of rooms and trying to find your way out.
I would like some assistance. I am in the room with four partial circles on each wall. I thought the object was simply to select two on each wall such that there was no overlapping. However, having done this, with the same shape on each wall, and the room still short of completion, I realised I was missing something. Then I noticed that the partial circles I had used in error and returned to the background were white, and those that I had not used were blue. I repeated what I had done before so that all the background shapes were white - no luck. I repeated again and made all the background shapes blue - no luck. Obviously I am missing something, and I am starting to worry that it is really obvious. I apologise for making this post so wordy, but I did not want to get the basic explanation back. Any help would be much appreciated.
Sergeant Pepper, have you noticed the backgrounds behind the partial circles?
They are identical, so maybe...
you should collect identical patterns to the front as well, which
are aligned similarly in relation to backgrounds.
Okay is something not loading for me, in the first red level a cube comes up that 4 checkered squares and is purple. There is a spinning shape in each corner and there is only one shape on that whole side, am I missing something???
I solved the blue room "Simon" puzzle by putting 4 different color thumbtacks in a square eraser to simulate the cube. Then I just copied the work. Here is a pic of it.
Clock room tip:
Use the red to "move" the greens one at a time.
I ran into Your problem too solving that puzzle on different machines, providing the ability to run the puzzle many times. One wall (don't remember which) have pieces that bring the right pattern, but does not bring the solution. Take the other two pieces present on that wall. The colour of the discarded pieces is irrelevant, which I discovered the same time I discovered the false couple. By that time I had at least two background (discarded) pieces white, but the puzzle solved out anyway!
Short of time I haven't solved the final ray-mirroring puzzle. I still do some research with the lenses. I tried to make some sense out of the grade-disc shadow which in some lenses throw elliptic shadows on the hole wall, and in some circular dito. So far I have failed, but I guess though I will have the answer soon, and will be able to see the light! Since I'm not second man out I'm in no hurry... Like this game! It's like a resort when one needs some distraction! Next challenge is to do the whole thing without pen and paper!
I did it! :)
Amor, I actually only realized that we are inside the dark complex when I saw your map. Before I just thought that the doors were some kind of portals to get to the other rooms.
But to solve the white room it really helps to have the map ;)
I made another map with all the rooms and the directions of the light beams so that it was just a matter of drawing the right paths for the lights. I can email the image for anyone who may want it.
In the green room sliding puzzle (with 6 patterns of red deco looking pieces), can anyone tell me which way they should all be facing?
They are like pie slices - do they all have to point to the center or do they all have to go in the same direction?
Guys, no-one seems to have mentioned the white room with all of the gearamids (I think) on one wall, and coloured circles running around the place. I haven't yet managed to make it do anything at all. Please help, i am going very mad!
DUMB! Really didn't like room BII1 (according to this map).
I solved it, but it didn't work, and I got frustrated so had to look for help.
If you're stuck, here's a hint:
The arrows DON'T point at each other, they point at the same face.
Can anyone help me with the slider puzzle in the green room at III;A;2?
Thanks to all of you, Your hints help me to end up this puzzle. According to me the more difficult was the last one; how to find the path from the lights to the good orbits.
ok so now that i finished, I can say, in my opinion, what rooms were more difficult.
- the gearmids: this one was actually the only one that I cheated.
and its not that difficult (now that I know the solution :P) We just have to look for every detail in the room. This one just needs a very good observation
- the globe: this one was the very last room I solved.
ok this was really hard. I had to use the good old paint to get all the faces. And at first I was looking to the images as if they were part of a cube, not a sphere. So they didn't match each other. After I start looking to it like a sphere it was easy to do the puzzle. But then you have to point the arrows some where. I tried lots of things and I was this close to cheat again. But then I just walked away and tried again other time and I did it. uhuhuhuhuh! couldn't believe it
- the white room: the final puzzle.
This one wasn't that difficult, I meen by now you already know the existence of the light beams, the bulbs and how the all thing works. You just have to point the beams correctly, and that takes work. I really wantedto finish this so, with the help of Amor's map I draw a map of the complex with the possible direction of the beams. It took me some time, but after that it was just a mather of draw the paths of the beams.
Ups! It didn't work, the red bulb is red, the green bulb is green, the pink is pink.. but it didn't work. Well, you just have to try all the combinations. But with the map it's easy
There were other rooms that were hard to solve also, but I already wrote plenty.
One thing more, tough
It really helped to have solved the dark room first. At least to know how things work and to know that to solve the white room you have to look somewhere else.
Satirus, I am having a terrible time getting the beams to go to the right places. I had the top, bottom and green done but I can't seem to get the other colors without messing those up. I would love it if you would send a map. THANK YOU!!!
Sure, just email me and I'll send you the map :)
I don't know your email address.
No one knows anyone's email addresses here because I do not publish them with the comments.
Satirus - if you send me the map (my email address is listed next to my picture in the sidebar), I'll upload it and create a link to it from your comment.
Ok so here they are the maps of the complex with the light beams informations.
Map with the beams directions. You still have to do all the work. So consider it a tool.
Map with beam directions
One of the solutions. This is an absolute spoiler. You don't really have to use it. It doesn't take that much work to find a solution using the first map.
One possible solution
Jay & Satirus - clicking on the typekey thing leads to a link saying "email me", so I assumed (yep, ass, you, me) that this link actually worked. Silly me.
Thank you so much for the pictures!!! It has been so frustrating going through 26 puzzles only to be stopped dead here for 3 days!
can someone please help me on both "eye" puzzles and the pixel clouds.
So, finally made it through! Thanx to all people at Jay I have compiled a
complete walkthrough at http://hem.fyristorg.com/dr_xemacs/aux/Walkthrough.pdf
Say, this is the best christmas gift ever!
Ps. Thanx Amor for all hints where I got stuck
**** VERY INFERIOR INITIATIVE ****
"help me here ! help me there ! someone knows this and that ? hey, here are the answers"
HEY, YOU HAVE SPOILED THIS BEAUTIFUL, INTELLIGENT GAME.
NOW EVERYONE CAN FIND THE SOLUTIONS FOR THIS BEAUTIFUL GAME RIGHT HERE. YOU HAVE MUTUALLY INVALIDATED ALL THE EFFORTS OF THE MAKER AND MADE THE HEROES LIST ACCESSABLE TO MEDIOCRITY AND CHEATERS!!
Besides this, you people are not entiteled to place your names or whatsoever on the heroes list, for you have not shown the capability to walk through alone - on your very own intellect and perseverance!
Sofar I spent a lot of time thinking and have gotten really quite far. I was looking forward to place my name on the heroes list as being one of few. But now that I just saw all your worthless entries there I take no more honor in being on that heroes list among you guys, so I will stop puzzling right this very moment. And I am really not appreciative !
Hi all. Just got my TypeKey profile.
Here is the
I promised earlier.
So let's skip the whole spoiler business right now shall we? Don't post any spoilers!
michello, weekminded creatures that cannot stay away from spoilers answer to themselves. Those who don't want the game spoiled don't look at them. So - don't look at the spoilers then!
Besides michello, where on earth does it say that You have to do all of it by yourself to put Your name on the list? I couldn't find any rule anywhere. Did You create it? If You're a Mensa it shouldn't be too difficult to appreciate the rules only too obvious.
Don't scare people away from a fabulous game by neglecting them a hint.
I have to agree. Some people need a little assistance, and rather than give up and be frustrated, it's tremendously more satisfying to get a hint here or there, or even a spoiler for something that cannot be figured out.
Please don't impose your values on others. If you don't want to look at spoilers, then don't. Furthermore, don't belittle those who do use them.
I respect the fact that you have your own set of values at Jay is Games.
But what's the point of entering your "Victory Words" in the "Hall of Heroes" when you have obtained hints from others ? Don't you want to challenge your brains ? See how far it can go ?
What is the point of publishing all answers for everyone to see ? Now, I won't study them, but others will. And they will pass this puzzle without the required efforts. Is this the set of values at Jay is Games ?
Now okay, but what "honour" is left for me to have my name in the "Hall of Heroes" when many others in the Hall have found the answers at Jay is Games?? (Hall-entries related to jay is games is now 50%) After all, being in the Hall of Heroes is the prize for those who have intellectually mastered this very difficult puzzle.
And, how can one tell how good one's performance is when the Hall is filled with fake Heroes ?
Yes, there are no rules forbidding the publishing of spoilers. But come on, you all know how damn irritating it is when someone spoils the plot, right... ?
Games are meant to be fun, and I think that is what is valued here most.
And where there are games, especially online games, there will always be "fake heroes". I believe your quest for honour is a futile one.
It all boils down to this one question: "But did you have fun playing?"
In the end, that's all that matters. It's your choice how you get there.
Let me ask You a question michello, what WERE You doing looking far down at this page, which You (and all others) DO know contain spoilers?
Looking for spoilers yourself?
(Not meant to be edgy, just curious)
PS. Lets all have fun! I had! And michello, read some of the words of greetings in the list! Many came there because of these beloathed spoilers! You might be one of the few ending up there all by yourself, but write that in the comment then! We will all stand silent in admiration!
Games are meant to be fun.. I agree.
I believe that this game is basically not really suitable for cheating, except when you do it the "Jay is Game-way". Which is basically doing it together, using the power of unified minds. You will have to agree with me on this one.
Puzzles are made to challenge the mind.
If the puzzle is too difficult, you will know where your limits lie..
I think it is also belittlling to provide people with answers to a puzzle. As if they cannot think for themselves. People tend to become more and more impatient with a harsh task, and that is when your spoilers become more and more tempting.
Once a player is tempted, the next spoiler is more easily accepted, and at the end the huge satisfaction of solving a complicated puzzle will definetly be less intense than if one would have solved it without this help.. ...hey okay, I can live with this conclusion.
Thanks for having me.
I do agree that solving puzzles together can be more gratifying than in isolation.
I also agree that solving a puzzle by oneself is significantly more gratifying than using a spoiler.
Let's celebrate the freedom to choose which path we take, along with the amazing talent and generosity of the game developers who offer up these wonderful experiences for us to play.
Thank you for visiting. =)
Doc, I was not looking for spoilers :-) I have been seriously playing the Dark Complex a few hours a day for about 1-1/2 week now, but when I started there was only 1 name (Jonathan's)entered in the Hall of Heroes. So I took this up as a challenge and was aiming for the second place entry. Then I got a little ill so I stopped playing for the last 3 days. Today I felt better and I wanted to see whether the second place was still to be taken. Then I saw that there were about 40 new entries (shock). The amount of Jay is Games related comments drew my attention to this site. I briefly looked here and there and found out why so many Jay is Games folks were present on the Hall of Heroes. I felt disadvantaged by the method many of these players had used, I mean...concerning the solitude efforts I already made sofar. That is why I ended up far down at this page - to protest ! :-)
I will not play for admiration (that is silly), but I will continue to play this puzzle without assistance and hopefully finish it for gratification. And if I make it I will comment appropriately Doc !
Have a good year's end - to all of you.
It seems I and Michello pulled off a lot of discussion here! I want to bring up another angling of the whole thing (might be that it doesn't belong here, but what the heck...)
The discussion here is very similar to the Microsoft VS Freeware discussion. The freeware forespeakers guard the freedom to construct programs and software as a result of joined efforts, with a heck of a good result in my opinion! The joined efforts are (with all due respect) often a lot more thought through and user friendly. It is often more inclinated to listening to peoples needs and wishes. AND... what is most important not commersialistic! There is not a race for earning a lot of money. The philosophy is very worth fighting for, don't You all agree?
With this angle I wish You all good gaming, and Michello, please stay playing TDC! The only one loosing if You quit would be yourself! No-one would miss You if You quit in anger!
And for the ones reading my walkthrough, please use it as a means for finding new ways to think, not as a way of cheating yourselves into the list! I really tried to solve most of it myself... I learned a lot by reading spoilers to the puzzles I really couldn't figure out (two or three)
Merry X-mas all of You!
Done, done, done, and now I can have my life back! Jay, if I was a guy I'd kiss you, and Satirus, you too (well maybe not as a guy, depending)!
I was able to solve the majority of puzzles without hints ... but I really appreciated the solve from Satirus because I was just turning dials fruitlessly and it had STOPPED BEING FUN.
Was I less than totally honourable in that particularly Klingon sense that michello touts? Well, sure, but I think that getting a hint or a solve when you're mired helps you learn the logic intended behind the puzzle. It teaches you to be a better player, opens your mind to possibilities.
I am proud of what I was able to do. Michello, if s/he has done TDC completely on his/her own, is proud I am sure. But that's no reason to say the holy hall of heroes has been betrayed. We know already the first people on the list are those who really did it on their own.
If Michello really is Mensa -- his/her statements are typical Mensa arrogance. It's as if they would prefer people were NOT capable of exercising their minds so they can stay on their holy little hilltop.
my .02 from my 138 non Mensa IQ
I was away for a while and I am a little shocked after reading Michello's criticism - but not surprised. Michello, my apologies for being one of those who has ruined the Dark Complex's Hall of heroes, not only by writing the spoilers but also using them.
However, I do not see people in here as cheaters. I see them as collaborators. Collaboration can be public like on Jay is Games or it can happen behind closed doors. My opinion is that the actual problem in this case is this Hall of Heroes. There's just no way to guarantee that any of the achievements on there are genuine.
So the harm is done and hopefully we all learned something from this. I learned that if I am ever going to put my name on these hall of heroes lists again, I will more clearly point out if and when I have achieved my place with the help of others. It is more than appropriate to acknowledge the people who have helped you.
Then I suggest not trusting on these lists of heroes unless there's really unambiguous way to guarantee that people have achieved their position on their own. Although I want to remind that the whole life is learning and collaboration. So all that we know today we have learned from someone else. Not only when reading some spoilers at the moment but maybe even years ago as kids when someone taught us the basic logic how to solve some puzzle.
Moreover, I challenge you (and me) to write better spoilers. Do not give immediate answers but challenge your friends to use their brains. Jay has added an excellent feature on this site so that you can give the information in pieces.
Guys - thanks for playing my game. Here's my 2 cents worth on the spoiler issue:
I think walkthroughs are okay if, say, there's one or two areas that you just can't solve and which are stopping you from playing the rest of the game.
Presumably nobody would use a walkthrough from beginning to end because that would just be boring and pointless, and if I'm wrong and there _are_ such people, then shouldn't we allow them such tiny pleasures as these spurious mentions in Halls of Heroes and the like, since obviously they don't lead very interesting lives (probably working in data-entry jobs) and hence mustn't have many highlights throughout their days.
Dr_X., I'm flattered that you took the time to produce such a detailed walkthrough, but your solution to the stars puzzle is plain wrong, and you have completely missed the point of how the colours in the final puzzle should be arranged... "trial and error" is not the most elegant method of solving that particular puzzle, and as it's the whole point of the game, I'd rather you had not published the solution to that one, particularly with no explanation of *how* the correct combination is derived.
Also, as the game is relatively new, I'd rather not advertise the complete solution on the same site, so I've [censored] your comments in the Hall of Fame.
Interesting discussion. I am learning. Unfortunately I must go to bed for it is after midnight here. But tomorrow after work I will revisit this topic.
Christine, saying "typical Mensa arrogance" is also typically arrogant ;-p
Any critisism or arguments from my part can be classified as such, right? It is just my inner point of view, nothing more. It is not faked, nor have I've been brainwashed at Mensa. So please don't use that as an argument, you are only hurting my personal feelings. I don't consider myself as being arrogant. As a matter of fact, I am very much loved and appreciated by others and I expect you to think the same of me.*
(*Jedi mind trick).
All credits to Your game. My admiration of it should be clear after all I have written in this forum. - My final colouring was wrong, my star colouring as well, OK... but they worked. Compared to a Sudoku, where You can't go wrong. One wrong figure, and redo... redo... Maybe a thought for following games. If there is a thought behind then no wrong solution should exist.
If the major opinion is for me to remove my Walkthrough, I'll do so [done], anyway I did it mostly for myself.
PS, Wonder what coming heroes will think of the censored comment I had... dirty?
I said I was in _favour_ of walkthroughs and I meant to say I that I thought you did a great job, except that my last post came out sounding rude, which is not what I intended.
My only gripes were that the solution was available directly from the site (which is now fixed, and why do you assume people will assume 'censored' is something rude? ;-) ... and, that the point of the last puzzle was missed, and since I think it's a rather nifty puzzle I would be most upset at the thought of people solving it and not really knowing why.
Anyway, I'll dust off the other Archipelago game next year when I've some free time and we'll see how quickly you do a walkthrough for that one ;-)
Jon, no offense taken. I agree though to the wish You had that the solution to the last puzzle (that wasn't correct, though it worked out) shouldn't have been posted, at least not by me. Actually it is better to wait for the regular clues as the ones in TDR, and from You. I am waiting for them, anxious to sense some of the original thoughts behind.
Since I started all this, I hope no one remains stepped on, and that we all have come out of this as better beings. Mensa or not! Then it was worth while!
Jay, keep up the good work! This is my favourite site, and I browse it through every now and then to find nuggets like TDC! Another nice little nugget I want to recommend because of its nice atmosphere is Samorost!
ps. The Archipelago was more difficult than TDR! Liked the atmosphere better in TDR and TDC though!
Doc & Jon, what about if Doc could just send a new phrase for the TDC's Hall of heroes?
Doc, I understood that Jon or enyone else didn't asked you to remove your walkthrough complitely. Jon just wanted to remove the link or feference to that material from the Hall of heroes. He has right to do that since it's his Web site.
So Doc, please, return your walkthrough if possible. It hurt the little archivist's soul in me to see the Web documents to come and go so quick.
I'm at work right now so I can't access the walkthrough, but I'll gladly send it to You when I'm able.
(Un)luckily it seems my nick I chose at TypeKey has the property of denying any access for anyone to my personal data, including my mail address!!! Try clicking my "Typekey Profile Page" icon! (must be the @ symbol)
As long as no one thinks I'm a dirty bastard it doesn't hurt any of my feelings to be censored... And, I still believe in Jon's right to keep his own spoilers.
Jon! If You like another phrase for the list, here's one: "Abel Babel Moses!"
Thank you Doc, please do send your walkthrough to me when you have time. I didn't had time to read it through and I allready cleared my browser's cache. It's just so fun way to reflect the Jon's excellent game.
And I do understand that you want to respect Jon's wish.
After some persuasion my walkthrough is back. As a tribute to good puzzlesolving and inspired by Ankh I have made it available at a secret place. Lets see who can find it!
Browsing up and down I can't refind that comment I know I wrote somewhere here. I meant to say (apropos Christine's utterance about Mensa arrogance) that maybe I initiated some bad words about Mensa. I really apologize for that, but I bounced when I read that comment. Let's all agree that there can be no such thing as categorizing like that. And we all have weeknesses and bad sides! No one should bullshit any other! Very soon one will get it back, and manyfold! Every discussion group I have participated in until now (and hopefully any I will in the future) cherished the property of being polite and nice. Lets keep it like that.
I found Doc's walkthrough!
Very good puzzle :D
Thanx! I would have expected You as the first one to find my secret!
Do I have to solve all of the rooms to completely solve The Dark Complex, b/c I still can't figure out the green room with the stars...
And for the white room, do I just have to
direct the beams to the correct lens rooms, or is that a separate puzzle?
solution to the green room is posted above, but
do the stars seem to have the same constellation on each wall, or
do they seem to be mirrored in some way. Maybe
the walls are mirrors.
dark complex may very well be solved with this green room unsolved. It depends on
how one solves the last ray puzzle
but would that solution make You comfortable?
You have solved TDC You will find that
the white room is no puzzle actually.
omg please someone help me...i solved all the puzzles, i just have to find out how to complete the beam puzzle. i know i have to match the beams to the correct lenses but i dont know where each one is..and if anyone found that walkthrough please tell me how to find it.
The beam puzzle
is easily solved when You know
which colour belongs to which lens. Try
lighting them up in different colours and see which
planet in the middle room that is lighted. Then
remember, or write it down.
This is the trial and error method. There is a way to conceive the solution, which I haven't found yet. The solution is rumoured to be very logic...
Hints for the 'logical' approach are allready given earlier by me and some others. E.g. use the Ctrl-F feature to find my (Amor Lassie's) spoiler on December 2nd. But once again:
The problem is that there can be more than one lens lit up with the same color at the same time. So you need to no which is the right one, right? There's no need to switch off them one by one and try to find the right lens in the hard way. The easy way is to go around the cube and peep through the holes til you can see the lit up planet to follow the same color orbit. And what does it mean?
It means that the right beam for that planet is coming from the opposite side.
Sent a mail via some strange hotmailaddress I have no clue as to which it was. Can You reply to my regular mailaddress plz?
First time wandering back to these comments since the issue with michello, and while I don't wish to reignite the argument, I still want to peacably share my thoughts.
I do not condemn cheating, but like most think that those who have avoided cheating are the better off for it, for the most part. As I already admitted here and would've in the hall of fame given more room to comment, I had small 'help' on a couple of puzzles (One of those because I have a nasty habit of reading all the posts here and clicking on spoiler tags that seem familiar before I realize that they are only something similar to something else...)
I do care about how help is given though. In no circumstances do I prefer an answer to just be given out without any requirements of the (for lack of a better term) 'cheater'. I will commonly enough give hints or even a walkthrough for particular levels, but never without giving the 'cheater' a chance to think for themselves. For levels that many people have passed but others are still stuck on, I generally use the handy system of nested spoilers, usually having more than 5 within eachother, to give a walkthrough of the level, small step by small step. If few people have solved the level, I'll give vague hints, but not much more. If no one else has solved the puzzle, I'll refuse to give any hints until other people solve it or it's painfully obvious that everyone else has met a dead end, where I'll still be somewhat vague. On the last puzzle of DC, I was planning on waiting a few days, and then I'd only release the tool I used for the last puzzle to give everyone who was stuck a sense of direction. Before this happened, though, other people solved it and themselves started posting hints here.
As for finishing the games? It is ultimately for your own fun, and has little to do with most. Those that it does have to do with are those who give the hints and, if you give any, those who get help from you, both groups of which I'm sure would be happier for the exchange (at least momentarily). I admit that since no one else had finished the puzzle before me, I still had the hope of admiration, but in retrospect, I've gotten very little, but am fine with that. While there are those that required help on the list and those that did not, even the highest of ranks has little extra joy in the end (and trust me, I've many slow finishes and even incompletes to compare this to). While you may have a certain goal of a high rank and may not reach that goal because of 'cheaters', there is no way of accurately detecting them 100% of the time, and that number would be even less if actions were taken against them. Whether you like 'cheaters' or not is not the issue, as they will remain throughout our days, so it is best to be glad that you have been able to solve something alone that they could only do with help.
The existence of 'cheaters' is a fact of life. While we can condemn individual 'cheaters' and make them reform, many of them will have less fun not solving puzzles than solving puzzles with little help. If you must point fingers, point them at those who force (not give hints towards) the answers on others, as they are the only ones who rob people of their fun.
As I stated at the beginning of this post, I do not want this to entirely reignite the argument. I request that you either peacably share your views as I have, or if you'd like to debate a certain point with me, E-mail me at @yahoo.com
You can also E-mail me if you'd like a look at the tool I created and used for the final puzzle (it seems noticably more user friendly than the other tools I have seen here, given most paint programs (I designed it in mspaint :P)) or for any other concievable reason that you'd wish to E-mail me specifically.
Bah, the E-mail address didn't show up right because of my use of less than and greater than symbol's to enclose the text "I'm sure you can figure it out" before the @yahoo.com.
My E-mail is public in my typekey profile as well.
I hope my removal came in time for the game not to be completely spoiled. The curious people can still find my walkthrough somewhere, given the info present in this discussion. Amor found it!
(more in mail, which I posted without looking at the Typekey profile)
can I just say that for a few of these being color blind (like myself), seems to be a handicap.
As regards spoilers, it's best if you don't just tell the order of operations to solve the room but the logic behind it.
For instance, I couldn't come up with the sequence for the eye rooms and came here for help and all I found was; click this, this and this. Not the reason WHY, I should do it like that.
Giving someone a fishing pole and showing them how to use it is much better that handing them a fish.
You have a good point, Fotav. Let me help you understand the logic behind the eye puzzles...
There is only one correct path "through" the maze created by the highlighted eyes. For example, in the room where 2 eyes are always highlighted, only one of them is the correct one to click, the other will return to back to the begining. Your task is to get through to the end of the 'maze'.
Having explored the eye-maze I just want to mention I did not end up in the beginning everytime I made an error, but somwhere else. What I did was to find a shortcut in another path I saw far above.
Anyway, I have looked it all through (my both mazemaps) but I sure can't make any sense out of it. Can anyone help me? I am overlooking something because of my flaw to rush through everything without thinking underways, that maybe there is another way. (I guess I "plan my life - live my plan", which so far have worked for me, but as I have noticed I almost never find the shortest path)
A kingdom for the thought behind the eyes puzzle!