Yay, I suggested this game a couple weeks ago. I played it at work and still found myself creeped out, even in a brightly lit room with other people around. Especially when

Really? So the way we are supposed to start a game/series to steer someone to commit suicide? That is so unbelievably stupid. That's the best you can come up with? I stopped right at that point, never to finish or return. Wow...

I respect your opinion, HammyJay, and I would hope you would respect others as well. :) It's a shame you didn't give the rest of the game a chance to see the motivations and meaning, though I can understand being made uncomfortable by suicide just as I'd hope you would understand someone else not being made uncomfortable by it rather than immediately branding it stupid.

Yeah, it's horror. Uhm.

Anyway, I was impressed before the game even started. ACCESSIBILITY OPTIONS. This is incredible. Since my comp has no sound, I'm making use of the "closed captioning". It may not win with colorblindness, but I do hope this becomes a trend.

I get if someone is killed by a zombie or made somehow to kill someone else or witness a killing or suicide - that would be an opening. But to actually control the character to take each necessary step to commit suicide, I'm sorry, but that is a stupid premise and shows the developer to have little imagination, at least in this instance.

We'll have to agree to disagree, HammyJay. I wish you would take a bit more of a respectable attitude towards the developer, human being to human being. They created an entire game series with a complex plot... I think it's safe to say they have plenty of imagination. It's fine if you don't want to play it or agree with the content, but do you really need to insult someone else based on the way they feel about subject matter just because it doesn't gel with your feelings on it? There are a lot of games out there for everyone to play, and none of them will ever have universal appeal or acceptance, but by simply choosing not to play or voice your opinion on the matter in a way that isn't a personal attack on the creators or the players is the only way we keep communications open and lead to understanding and dialogue between one another.

Okay, that was awesome. Definitely not for the squeamish -- I wouldn't rec it to a good number of my friends. But if you've got a well-thumbed copy of Poe, and Hitchcock is in your queue, it's surely a nice little bite of the macabre. Don't worry about the dark pixels; if The X-Files had an active cursor... wait, there was that one episode, never mind. In any case, there are way too many horror titles that try too hard, while this goes down the simpler route of making you break a few taboos.

Enjoy your nightmares! :D

I have been enjoying it, but I'm stuck -

Hint, please?

@baileydonk I puzzled over that too. Here's some hints.

The Last Door - Chapter 1: The Letter Walkthrough

Thanks to starchild for the walkthrough!

It took me two sessions to beat this game. Never have I "noped" so hard.

Chilling indeed. As the developers said, it's best to play this in the dark with either really good speakers or, preferably, headphones.

OK, that was flat-out creepy. Excellent!

It seems like an awesome game, but I had to stop playing after

for the same reason as frickeneh.

Plus I'd already been to

and know the rest of the game is going to be filled with nopes.

Am I missing something, or is there some incongruity between the upstairs and downstairs levels? Or are the doorways with a map-looking item above them leading to stairs that we don't see?

Pixellated games give my imagination too much flexibility to scare the bejeezus out of me. E.g. Ib, that one where you're walking through the forest trying to get food before the lamp runs out...

Great game. Brilliant! Scary! No closure at end of Part One. Let's hope the future parts give that.

jeeze... thanks for the spoilers, HammyJay :(

HammyJay, while I definitely agree with Dora about being more respectful, I'm also intrigued by what you actually mean. You had a pretty strong reaction, which I always find interesting, but what you've said doesn't make much sense to me at the moment.

"Lack of imagination" usually means unoriginality. But that can't be quite what you mean here, because i) It's not like we're awash with games that start like this and ii) the examples you give in your second comment (zombies, witnessing a death) come up FAR more often.

So is that you find it distasteful? I can certainly see how people would find it that way, and I think that's an interesting conversation to have. Why does this kind of sequence feel more uncomfortable than all the other virtual killing gamers regularly participate in?

Personally, I really enjoyed it when I played it a few months back, although as usual with Indie games I would liked a little more attention to have been given to the text, which felt pretty rough in places.

I did think about asking whether they wanted any editing help for future episodes, since they seem to be looking for community feedback and participation, but I couldn't decide if that was presumptuous and rude.

I think, richmcd, the main thing to remember is that it's fine for someone to find one topic more sensitive than another. The most obvious answer to why that may be is simply personal experience. Someone who lost a loved one to an act of violence or suicide, for instance, might have drastically different feelings about both of those topics and be uncomfortable seeing them in games, and I don't think that's anything we should ever try to change because people should and do have the right to decide what they do and don't want to support. Neither you or I has any right to try to tell someone why something shouldn't upset them.

All I'm asking is that people who ARE uncomfortable with subject matter of any sort express why in a manner that doesn't attack other people. It's fine to discuss why you don't like something and share your feelings on it. It's not fine to do so in a way that insults the creators and everyone who plays it by implying that there's something wrong with them for not sharing your opinion.

Hi Dora,

I agree with everything you say, so I must admit I'm a bit confused by your response, which seems to be addressing things I don't think I said or implied. Maybe my comment was unclear. Sorry if it was.

I'm certainly not saying it's wrong to find the game distasteful or uncomfortable, and it's obvious to me why someone might (suicide is a subject which has affected me personally, and if the scene in question had been much longer I probably wouldn't have continued with the game).

But HammyJay didn't express distaste. And what was expressed (rudeness aside) doesn't really fit with the available facts. So I was just wondering whether HammyJay meant something slightly different by "unimaginative". Distaste or discomfort at that sequence seemed the most likely. I offer no judgment beyond that, other than the fact that it seems an interesting thing to talk about.

The rhetorical question at the end of my third paragraph wasn't accusatory (I think the sequence definitely IS more affecting than other kinds of in-game killing), it was intended to frame the kind of question that would be worth discussing.

All I was doing was responding to your question as to why someone would find this distasteful and not ultra-violence by offering a scenario as to why that might be. :) "Why does this kind of sequence feel more uncomfortable than all the other virtual killing gamers regularly participate in?" I know it's rhetorical, but I felt like responding to it and expanding my thoughts on the matter. That's all.

I see. Thanks!

Sorry, I think your first sentence threw me, and made me misinterpret the rest. I hope I didn't seem prickly and defensive. I really was just worried that I'd been unclear. These little comment boxes aren't great for tone.

Anyway, leaving the original comment that sparked this aside (it doesn't look like HammyJay is coming back), I think actually what interests me about this scene is its effectiveness for people who AREN'T touched by the issue.

Taking me as an example, you only have to mention the word "suicide" and it's going to be triggering. So those feelings aren't hard to explain, at least on a superficial level. If someone wanted to make a game that would personally affect me, it wouldn't be hard. It would just probably fail to make an impression on anyone else (and there'd be a huge risk of making me feel angry and manipulated).

But this scene seems to work in general, even for people who aren't close to the issue, and it's THAT that seems worth thinking about. Why does it work? After all,

To M. Hammy: Personally, I find the mass killing of zombies quite distasteful, in that it desensitizes the act of ending lives, and tramples upon the rights of zombies everywhere.

Quite intimately disturbing, eh? I think some corners of mainstream media may have watered down the historical roots of horror. In order to be classed as horror, it had to be intimate and disturbing. Possibly there's some confusion when someone clicks on and says "Hey, a horror game!" and figures on a generic shoot 'em up.

Mm mm mm. It's horror. I think the review sufficiently warned everyone of that (kudos for that, by the by). It's cool to explore *why* it's intimate and disturbing -- but I do raise a brow at that note of shocked surprise that something labeled horror is horrifying. Heavens! What is the world coming to! I guess you might've missed those original versions of fairy tales... but I digress.

Different people find different ways to be amused by games. It's one of the reasons why I frequent JiG, to discover those shades of amusement. To state the obvious: not everyone will like this game, but that in itself doesn't lead to it being a poorly done game. It's just not your cuppa, and that's perfectly okay. What's generally not okay is projecting your reaction to denigrate the game itself, while not explaining that reaction very much at all.

It's unhelpful to the developers, the reviewers, and fellow commenters. Of course, if you want to come back around and actually discuss it, there seems to be a lot of people who'd want to listen.

As someone who has been affected by suicide and who knows others in the same situation, I can understand the upset and frustration that would lead to someone calling it "stupid." While not a constructive comment, it is one that probably comes out of a deep, overwhelmingly emotional reaction. Who is, when feeling such sadness, so eloquent with our words?

I want JIG to remain a welcoming community, but that also means not going overboard with the chastisement as much as we should not go overboard with other insults. It helps just as much to turn that open-mindedness we ask others to use on those same people we're asking to be open-minded.

I would agree, elle, but I don't see the problem in responding to a comment with my own thoughts, opinions, and beliefs on the matter in a respectful fashion and asking for others to do the same when they attack someone. I don't think responding twice to the same person clarifying my stance is "going overboard" personally anymore than HammyJay or others were going overboard by posting their own. :)

I think leading the character to do what he did to start the game totally set the tone for this game and was a shock in itself, because I've never played a game that started that way. Unimaginative? I don't think so. It's just a game just like all the other violent games out there. Just because you enjoy GTA doesn't mean you're going to mow down hookers in your stolen car for real. That being said this was one of the better games I've played on JIG in a while. No disrespect to the other fine games I've enjoyed here, but this one had a feel and a flow and an atmosphere all it's own. Great fluidity to the game play, and the story and text only enhances the game instead of hindering it like some other games that attempt this style. I can't wait for chapter 2.

I was only slightly offended myself... by the blatant E. A. Poe ripoff without giving credit. Sure he's out of copyright, but give the guy credit at least! Sheesh.

Great game and atmosphere, though.

@HammyJay, @Dora, @Richmcd. I reacted the same way. I stopped playing the game the second I understood my objective was to commit suicide. I came here to write about it, but there was already a discussion going on. Aside what has already been said, the thing is, the opening that does not add any value to the story or the gameplay. The narration would not have changed a single bit if the opening had been a non-interactive animation, besides the fact that there is no real puzzle to solve for the player. Suicide is a strong act for everyone. It triggers reactions that are not fictional by emotional means for some people especially in a first person experience, unlike killing a zombie or playing a third person villain. Thinking that there is no age verification or parental warning in your game, you should have been much more sensitive.

Thinking that there is no age verification or parental warning in the game, they should have been much more sensitive.

Hi WinZip. Thanks for taking the time to express your thoughts and feelings in the way that you did. I'll disagree that it adds no value to the story (I can't say more without spoilers) as it's a fairly important plot point and catalyst with good reason, but I can understand someone having a reaction strong enough to it to not want to play further and find out, even if I don't personally share your feelings about suicide myself. (And for what it's worth, I DID give the game a strong rating and warn about the content in the review.)

I do agree that there's not much reason for the opening to be interactive, and perhaps for some people it wouldn't have been such a shock had they not been asked to take part, though I also feel like it's difficult to know when that would be the case as a creator, since other people would probably also tell you the same is true about games that force you to kill people. Someone who suffered a loss in their family through an act of violence might find being forced to pull the trigger in a game that's structured or story-centric like this far more painful even if they were ambivalent about suicide.

For example, (spoilers for personal stuff)

I guess my point is that you can neither assume nor project anything about anyone. :) Hopefully the developers take your suggestion and put a mention of extreme content warning somewhere on the game itself for people who feel the way you do.

Hi Dora. Thank you too for taking time to reply each and every comment. I hope the developers are reading these; the comments are full with useful feedback.

HammyJay. I agree with you and I considered leaving right after that since suicide is immoral. Dora, while you said you wanted Hammy to respect other's opinions, he did while you did not respect his opinion, but told him "No you can't call this opening stupid because that's illegal." If you like the opening then explain why, (like Hammy did).

I tend to agree with HammyJay and WinZIP that making it "gameplay" to direct a character through suicide is distasteful, particularly as the setup to the game itself. The interactivity is gratuitous. Shudog's bringing in "zombie rights" is not an argument at all unless Shudog thinks zombies are real. Suicide is real, and real people have real experiences with it, and game designers might want to keep that in mind.

It took so long for scenes to load that when I saw the title sequence after the suicide, I first thought they were end credits and I was like, "Stupidest. Game. Ever." Maybe that's why HammyJay thought it was a dumb game.

I do give the designers props for thinking about accessibility options. Given the pixel-y design, it's attractive and atmospheric. But S-L-O-W. I give it a "meh" to "meh-minus."

Catherine K, what game are you talking about? It sounds like something I'd sure as hell love to play.

While suicide is obviously real and something that impacts many people, the same can be said for violence of all forms, murder, and many of the other shocking or painful elements present in this game's story. I don't think it's reasonable to expect a person with different views and experiences from your own to intuitively know you'd be okay with all but one of those presented one way and to know to warn you about that specific thing. I believe saying, "Hey, I found that distasteful, maybe you could consider putting a warning up" is one thing, whereas just saying someone should know better is another thing entirely, especially when dealing with a genre that's known for uncomfortable subject matter.

Personally, I think as long as nobody is being physically hurt by it, no topic should be off limits in gaming. (Or books, or movies, or television.) You can decide whether to watch or partake, and you can decide whether you feel it was handled appropriately or added anything to the overall experience, but I don't believe you should be able to tell someone what they should or shouldn't make based on your own feelings and experiences. Should you discuss it and say why you didn't like it? Absolutely! I have never said anyone shouldn't! I have played many games over the years I felt were personally upsetting or offensive. I just think "I didn't like this and felt like this was handled poorly because..." is much different (and more helpful to communication and criticism) than "I hate this, it sucks and it's immoral". I'm not saying anyone has to agree with anyone else on whether a scene or topic is viable or handled well or not, but you DO have to be able to express yourself in a way that respects the other person in the argument just as much as you are demanding they respect you.

(And for what it's worth, I have also extended an invitation to the developers to participate in the discussion so everyone can get their feedback in. :) )

i dig what you said, Dora. I totally agree, one hundred percent. It's one thing to dislike something, but it's something completely different to crap on someone else for liking something you don't. If everyone tried to take everyone's feelings into account before doing something, NOTHING would ever get done. Nothing. As long as something is not illegal, or harmful to you or someone else, voice your displeasure in a way that respects everyone else's opinion then move on.

Zombies are often representative of the Other, and in contemporary fiction they function in a nearly identical manner as actual propaganda targeting groups of -- get this -- quite real human beings. To me, at least, killing things over and over and over again, just because they're "not human" is not automatically okay. Even leaving aside whether/how/if players are desensitized and conditioned. Nearly any lengthy history book will detail how this dehumanization is the first step to alienating and attempting to eliminate any number of groups. Not to mention current news outlets.

So yes. That is quite real. Just because there's a multitude of games that use those mechanics doesn't make that palatable for all. The argument that suicide is real, and zombies aren't, perhaps misses my grim humor (because it's no fun to do essays on what you see every day, so for some of us tis better to laugh). But once again -- you cannot assume that everybody shares your morality, and that justifies scoffing away any alternate trains of thought. Note also that I was responding directly to Hammy's comments.

Also, I never once said that the content was not disturbing. It is! Like I said, I have several friends to whom I wouldn't even mention this game, much less recommend it. I haven't noticed anyone disagreeing on that front (which should be notable re: the effectiveness of the story). And that was my point -- Hammy was implying that all these other gameplay tropes were perfectly fine in comparison to the game's opening, and I just disagree. I apologize if that bit came off as facetious.

However, I stand by my original Captain Obvious statement: it is horror. It is horror on par with any number of literary works that are likely studied in classrooms. We may be more accustomed to the fantastical horror that won't really hurt us, but guys -- the horror genre is not by a long-shot limited to that, and its goal is to *disturb*. It's just my personal feeling that the discussion of the game's impact cannot begin with surprise and disgust that a game in a stated genre fits that particular genre. Especially when the developers clearly dug deep through that genre in order to produce their work. And particularly when the reviewers spend a lot of time and energy informing us what's in store.

Uhm, can I please point out that I..kind of...really like the opening...? ^^''

It's a unique way to start a game. You always SEE a character do something really, really bad that you might not agree with. But you're playing the character doing something really, really bad that you might not agree with. It draws you in, and you feel more attached to the character as you play him, just like every other video game character. When he dies, because you've become somewhat attached to him, it makes you more eager to find out why he did the thing he did.

@swansongstudios101
Yes, that's exactly how I felt about it. You start out not knowing the character's motives, so you can't judge him or pity him really, but, as you said, it does draw you in and makes you want to know what drove him to suicide more than a cutscene would. That being said, I have no personal suicide-related experiences, so to me it was just a storytelling choice by the devs, and a very successful one at that. I wouldn't have been so interested in Anthony's fate if I hadn't controlled him at the beginning, if I had been a mere passive observer.

Although I'm tempted, I'm going to just steer clear of the discussion in regard to the opening sequence. I will go ahead and say that I think it adds a lot of flavour to the game. I can imagine that not everyone feels the same way about this, but then again the game is clearly marked 'horror'. Expect to be horrified.

Re: the game itself; apart from

it's spot on in just about every respect. Smells of Lovecraft.

Swansong and Starchild: Part of why I found the suicide gratuitous is that it happens in the opening sequence, BEFORE I've formed any attachment to the character. It's horror? Fine, but couldn't the suicide have been a cutscene?

"Personally, I think as long as nobody is being physically hurt by it, no topic should be off limits in gaming." There is a difference between declaring something off limits and saying something shouldn't be handled clumsily. I don't want to see a game where my character has to try to rape as many people as possible or where I win by inciting a race riot. That doesn't mean rape or racism are "off limits," that means I want you to bring some thoughtful analysis of difficult topics if you incorporate them into your gameplay. This game fails to do that.

That's your opinion, Carny, and also why the rest of my comment states "You can decide whether to watch or partake, and you can decide whether you feel it was handled appropriately or added anything to the overall experience, but I don't believe you should be able to tell someone what they should or shouldn't make based on your own feelings and experiences. Should you discuss it and say why you didn't like it? Absolutely!" :)

As someone who has been struggling with suicidal thoughts for a long time, and even attempted it once, I didn't find the opening insulting or distasteful. I found it deeply sad, and I was intrigued by the secret that made Anthony end his own life. This pulled me into the game, and made me want to help him, or at least redeem him, to do what I can. That said, I can accept if someone rejects the idea of forcing the player to assist in a suicide. We are different.
The story looks interesting, and the atmosphere was fantastic, really eerie without cheap jump scares. I'm looking forward to the next chapter.

I'm really enjoying ch. 1, but I'm having a little trouble

I'm not going to weigh in on the merits of the prologue debate, but I will say that the game itself would have been super creepy even if that had been a cutscene.

Hello, I've been reading everyone's comments, guess there's nothing for me to add to the discusssion with Hammyjay.

I've just finished the 1st chapter, I must say that I actually enjoyed it a lot.

Perhaps it's only me, but I really didn't find the suicide scene as "shocking" as some of you guys seemed to (I have experiences with suicide aswell). I actually just found it intriguing as to where that may lead in the plot of the game.

By saying that I would also like to add that, different people react to different things different ways, this may sound obvious but I think it would be nice adding that here.

Anyways, loved the depressing/gloomy/dark atmosphere the game creates, the music and the story were pretty neat(so far, hopefully it leads to more awesomeness).

That Crow scene, that scene really reminded me of Poe! Seriously, if any of the crows yells "Nevermore!" I would actually think it's a nice reference to Edgar Allan Poe.

It's a HORROR game and as such does not need "parental warnings", "age verification" or "ratings". It is implied by the Genre itself that you should be an adult or at the very least, of adult maturity if you are going to play a Horror game! Crying out loud! You think suicide is tasteless? Well sorry but you're in the wrong Genre. It's supposed to be disturbing. There was a time that the very mention of clowns would send me into a corner while bawling my eyes out in the fetal position, but you don't see me telling people to change their games because it has clowns in it. Yes, it's disturbing but it's a very real thing. They weren't mocking the act so what is your deal??

I'm having a problem! I have already:

Somebody please help me! There must be a step I'm missing, but I can't see what it could be in the walkthrough.

I'm having the same trouble as (ceciliagfranck | August 6, 2013 5:51 PM) and (malone.audrey | October 17, 2013 8:46 PM)

I started out doing well on my own, then began to follow the walkthrough. I don't know why we're hitting this snag here. Are we missing something? Should I not have gone ahead and

*ahem* I FIGURED OUT HOW TO DO THAT THING WE'VE BEEN HAVING TROUBLE WITH. *cough*

I think the walkthrough may have missed this detail.

Actually, I think the way to get unstuck ray9na mentions is to

About the Hammer Thing:

General tip:

I Like the series and I have also had close encounters with suicide...albeit I never tried to hang myself or had a family member choose this method.

I think the fact that some people are uncomfortable enough to need to discuss content suitability means the series did a good job of unsettling us...really it's the hallmark of a good psychological thriller.

As somebody who has experienced a close relative committing suicide (in quite the same manner as in the game), I do think all the discussion about taste is seriously silly. I do not know what is immoral about suicide; all people do have depressive thoughts from time till time and there will, although with different situations and pressure for each one of us, always be a limit to what a person can handle. I can only wonder what led this person to give up on life and will play chapter two.

Actually, there is a song by Opeth on the subject of suicide (Dirge of November) that is much more intense than clicking a couple of times and see it happen - but that is to me. Stay constructive please, if you need help to process your loss, seek professional guidance instead of attacking a developer of a unique game like this.

Just played this and i found it pretty awesome, I am sort of known for being really stoic between my friends and people in general and this game did manage to surprise me, it is pretty unique, almost every piece of it was filled with creepiness of a kind I just couldn't find in many places before, even recommended it to one of my buddies!
Can't wait to play the next one! On another day, don't think I can handle them both in a single day.